Age-specific training plans

Ahh, with The Sufferfest that’s essentially NM or neuromuscular power - 5s max power.

The 4DP profile covers these (from memory so hoping they’re right!):
5s power - NM
1m power - AC (Anaerobic Capacity)
5m power - MAP
20m power - FTP

Okay, wrong guess :slight_smile:

Should’ve Googled it: Maximum aerobic power (MAP) is, thus, the maximum power developed through a maximum heart rate aerobic metabolism, reached when the subject uses his/her maximal oxygen uptake (VO2 max )

I have no clue how best to improve that. My last lab test (almost 2 years ago) returned a VO2 Max of 62, in the meantime, Garmin has upped that to 71, but I’m not sure that is totally trustworthy, let alone that I know how that ‘translates’ to MAP.

One thing is for sure: it’s gonna hurt :joy: The minions will be proud.

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My VO2 from Garmin is currently 50, so I have a lot of scope to build I hope!

Yes, I think my future holds a lot of swearing and sweating! :nauseated_face: :rofl:

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I think FTP is probably a % of your 20 minute power, after a test? I have abandoned that approach years ago, as it is prone to (too many) errors.

It’s still meaningful to some extend and lots of people will tell you I’m full of ykw, but either way, it’s up to you to figure it out.

With the new 4DP test they take the full 20 minute power, as it comes after 2 x 7s sprints and a 5m test so you should be reasonably fatigued, enough to not need to take a percentage figure anyway. The 1 min comes after that. They did a lot of testing and believe it’s as accurate as any single test can be.

Once you have these numbers, they compare how each stacks up against the others to provide a more complete picture and work out what your strength and weakness are, then every workout after that is adjusted automatically to address and improve both.

It’s this automatic adjustment that I’m hoping might be tweakable to account for age, but the SUF science people will have to look into that. In the meantime I’ll see how adjusting plans or making my own helps me improve. I also know that I perform poorly in ramp tests, as I fade quickly as soon as I go over FTP for more than a couple of minutes. The 4DP test has my weakness switching from sustained efforts to VO2 max fairly often, so that seems about right.

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I see… Well, I’ll stick to Xert, but I’ve seen here that people are already trying to figure out how they compare.

Mainly, because they don’t want Xert’s dull training sessions (just a tat better than looking at TR’s bars) and like the SUF video workouts to go with it.

But that only works if you have your parameters right, at both ends. Which is complicated.

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@Coach.Spencer.R wrote a great topic a few weeks ago about the importance of strength training as we age.
:slight_smile:

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Yes, that was useful. I’m already following a strength program, or I was, until I injured my shoulder lifting a sheet of plywood! I used to be a bodybuilder so understand how to perform the exercises and am used to fairly heavy weight. I found the SUFStr sessions too easy and where many people reported feeling sore I didn’t feel a thing so went back to weights. I’m starting from a different place to many cyclists though.

Joe’s book suggests performing heavy lifts with low reps, and sets which could vary depending on age and/or experience. I’m lifting for 3 sets of 5 at or close to 5 rep max, full body routine (squat, deadlift, bench press, overhead press and biceps curls) twice a week, usually on the lower intensity days. I reduce weight on recovery weeks.

I believe everyone should lift weights, athlete or not, to reduce lean tissue loss from ageing. As a MTB racer I need a strong body to cope with the demands and also protect me during my inevitable crashes.

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Approaching 50 myself and I think an age specific plan would be useful.

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I’m turning 63 and have asked this question a few different ways here. Fairly new to Sufferfest and structured training. Would love to see more content from the coaches on this subject. I’m finding that I need more recovery time than the training plan has built in. May need to switch to Friel’s 9 day week approach.

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@langedp if you haven’t already, it’s worth reading or listening to the book. Lots of information in there for the older athlete.

Fast after 50? Got it. That’s why I asked a previous question about recovery time. In that book, Joe recommends no more than 2 HIIT sessions per week for the 60+ cyclist. Just need more recovery time at our age. Been doing HRV recently as well to try and measure this.

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Recovery and adaptation is, no doubt, paramount to all athletes. For folks 50 and over, most should be on a 2on/1off program.
The key is dosing of the right high intensity workouts based on your what your weakness and then getting proper recovery to adapt. If you do 70% of a plan while getting in key high intensity workouts, you’ll be successful. If you need more recovery, take it. I would, of course, suggest a customized plan, especially if you are on your own strength plan. By the way, I’m 61 and care deeply about age related issues and how to maximize health and fitness.

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I’ve been thinking this for a while, especially as my racing is so unusual (very short, intense MTB racing, usually under 10 minutes). Add in my own strength plan and age and it makes sense. Age isn’t such a big thing right now but I’d like to get ahead of the curve as it’s only a matter of time! I’d better look up the details I guess :slight_smile:

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Thanks for chiming in here coach. Do you agree with Friel’s stance about no more than 2 HIIT sessions per week or can us 60+ folks go harder than that? I know it varies by individual but in general? I just took a few more days recovery in my 12 week plan and felt much better after todays session. Just need to figure out how to construct the rest of the plan now!

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Hey @langedp,
I think two hard workouts/week in general for folks 60+ is good advice. You may be able to do three once or twice in a 12 week plan coming off a recovery week.You just have to look at the density of the intensity. All high intensity workouts are not created equal…so choosing the right type of workout is very important. The SUF plans do that automatically and in the right dose, so all you need to do is monitor how recovery is going.

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Thanks coach. I’m now monitoring how recovery is going with HRV. I’ll also be doing Half Monty soon and will see if my numbers are set right as well.

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I’m still working on that :rofl:

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So here’s where my understanding goes off the rails. I’m 68 so looking at doing 2 hard w/o per week. Just threw a demo Novice All Purpose Road plan up to see what it looks like. I’m assuming this is a 2 on 1 off setup

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Correct…with an occasional 3rd hard workout